Visual vs "Visual Kei"

[Alice the Sister]

How do you know if a band is just being 'visual' with their music, or if they're part of the so-called "Visual Kei" scene? Like a lot of post-Visual Kei bands like that of L'arc~en~Ciel and Dir en grey still used a lot of visuals, but weren't really part of the established Visual Kei genre anymore due to it being a completely stripped down visual and m.o compared to the other active bands.

So yeah. How do you tell it's a "visual" band between just a Visual Kei sort of thing?

And when I say visual band, I mean....like you know how you don't go callin' Kiss Visual Kei or all the black metal bands with face paint, visual kei? Yeah sorta like that.

[Culo]

In Japan, bands who used to be involved with the VK scene will always be associated with it. Maybe the newest GLAY or L'Arc en Ciel fans don't, but the old fans will still see them as VK people I think.
Just today I was looking at some "top 10 best visual kei bands" thread in 2ch (japanese bbs) and 1st place was GLAY, 2nd L'Arc... later came DEAD END, X, BUCK-TICK, etc.

[signal to noise]

i kindof think that visual kei is just an immature phase before growing into your own thing. L'arc is an example, as well as Luna Sea, Dir en grey, etc. a lot of bands that are strongly associated with that scene end up growing up out of it. i bet in a few years bands like Alice Nine and The Gazette will be doing the same thing.

[nekki_chibi]

alice 9 and gazette won't appeal to non-visual audience - their music isn't that great (especially Arisu9 - though they could dive into jpop and catch some attention), and I'm pretty sure Gazette will disband if they distract from the scene - they won't get popular enough without VK-fans support.

[yuna001]

i kindof think that visual kei is just an immature phase before growing into your own thing. L'arc is an example, as well as Luna Sea, Dir en grey, etc. a lot of bands that are strongly associated with that scene end up growing up out of it. i bet in a few years bands like Alice Nine and The Gazette will be doing the same thing.

.. What? What about the visual kei greats that actually stayed visual throughout their entire career like Lareine, Malice Mizer, or JILS? Are you calling their entire discography byproducts of an "immature phase" ? VK, to some bands, is more than just dressing pretty to gain an audience(like trash such as Gazette and A9. Pure garbage) It's an art.

[MY BABY DADDAY P-GWIDDLES]

That's right motherfucker
alice nine does suck though

[Do As Eternity 6]

i kindof think that visual kei is just an immature phase before growing into your own thing. L'arc is an example, as well as Luna Sea, Dir en grey, etc. a lot of bands that are strongly associated with that scene end up growing up out of it. i bet in a few years bands like Alice Nine and The Gazette will be doing the same thing.

actually i agree with you for the most part. Maybe not so much a byproduct of an immature phase but for most bands it passes by.

[Karasu]

alice 9 and gazette won't appeal to non-visual audience - their music isn't that great (especially Arisu9 - though they could dive into jpop and catch some attention), and I'm pretty sure Gazette will disband if they distract from the scene - they won't get popular enough without VK-fans support.

Hopefully you didn't just piss off 50000 kids and they go apeshit in this thread.



Well as i've said with friends and in other debates regarding this subject. Some bands who were VK dropped it completely and focused more on IMAGE. There's a difference between Visual and Image, and bands like Dir en grey, MUCC [i guess], and Merry now I think...are focusing more on the image they're trying to portray, rather than how Visual they could be. Plus, lets not forget some bands don't even like the scene anymore and have expressed that.

[Alice the Sister]

What about bands like Noir Fleurir? They had a small time frame where they completely stopped dressing up altogether and just looked like a regular rock/punk-rock sorta jig.

[Alice the Sister]

But if they're music was still the same and they were still playing in the Visual Kei 'circuit' wouldn't they still be socially considered as a Visual Kei band?

[カレン]

I pretty much go by... if a band is still featured in visual music stores and visual magazines, then they are considered visual, even if they don't think of themselves as part of the scene.

Even thought I don't AGREE with it (Like seeing SID in Cure kinda pisses me off), but that's just the way it is.

[Do As Eternity 6]

@ alice: yes but i think what naja said is right anyway. That in japan if you where associated with the vk scene to begin with you pretty much are still considered vk.

as far as gaze or a9 or whoever surviving without their image... I think they would be able to. For one thing a9's sound would fit in the J-pop-rock thingamajigger sounds. So i don't think it would be that hard for them. Gazette would be harder because their sound doesn't fit so easily into that but i don't think it would be much of a problem look at dir en grey >.< ah and alot of bands seem to be increasing in popularity lately looking on oricon but i could be wrong. I don't know much *hides*

[signal to noise]

i kindof think that visual kei is just an immature phase before growing into your own thing. L'arc is an example, as well as Luna Sea, Dir en grey, etc. a lot of bands that are strongly associated with that scene end up growing up out of it. i bet in a few years bands like Alice Nine and The Gazette will be doing the same thing.

.. What? What about the visual kei greats that actually stayed visual throughout their entire career like Lareine, Malice Mizer, or JILS? Are you calling their entire discography byproducts of an "immature phase" ? VK, to some bands, is more than just dressing pretty to gain an audience(like trash such as Gazette and A9. Pure garbage) It's an art.

Malice Mizer was always immature. i cant take a band that dresses up as winged demon/angel things seriously at all, and neither can the general public.

[yuna001]

i kindof think that visual kei is just an immature phase before growing into your own thing. L'arc is an example, as well as Luna Sea, Dir en grey, etc. a lot of bands that are strongly associated with that scene end up growing up out of it. i bet in a few years bands like Alice Nine and The Gazette will be doing the same thing.

.. What? What about the visual kei greats that actually stayed visual throughout their entire career like Lareine, Malice Mizer, or JILS? Are you calling their entire discography byproducts of an "immature phase" ? VK, to some bands, is more than just dressing pretty to gain an audience(like trash such as Gazette and A9. Pure garbage) It's an art.

Malice Mizer was always immature. i cant take a band that dresses up as winged demon/angel things seriously at all, and neither can the general public.

Judging from your avatar, I can see you are a fan of Dir en grey.

You can't take Malice Mizer seriously.. But you can take Dir en grey's ridiculous, prepubescent angst seriously? When Kyo cuts himself and throws his body around on stage like a 3 year old child throwing a fucking tantrum? Oh, yeah. I think that's way more easier to mock than a band dressing up in elaborate costumes to tell a story (as cheesy and sappy as that story may be)

And since when has the popularity of something within the general public been an indicator of quality?

[Alice the Sister]

And it would be preposterous for anyone to suggest that it is somewhat immature for what Dir en grey does/did and what Malice Mizer did.

Then again, I'd argue that Dir en grey had a much more 'mature' sense in the fact that they didn't do "goofy" stuff that people would scoff at.