[Hint: I have opinions. So do you. Our opinions are like hats. I wouldn't want you to wear my hat. If you like my hat, you are free to go buy your own that looks like it, but that's up to you.]
I continually see people comparing Visual Kei to nu-metal. I think to myself that I can see the similarities, but really...it's only in popularity and its place in that particular culture. However, that was a handful of years ago.
I don't intend on placing any negative connotations on "nu-metal" or "visual kei". Both are loosely defined 'communities' of music anyways.
I was listening to a song by Babylon the other day and the guitars and the vocals reminded me of how some of the workings were on some numetal songs. I can't quite understand the lyrics though, so I don't know if it's as cheesy as most nu-metal is. What are the audiences for Visual Kei in Japan compared to what the audience for Nu-metal is over here? Are the PVs similar? I suppose we can ignore the fact that VK dresses up, and Nu-metal might not necessarily.
Nowadays, I'm wondering what your thoughts are on this? Compare the two, I suppose. I always see people doing it, and I'd like to see what you guys think.
i think some of the guitar riffs and playing style and a tiny bit of the video imagery can be similar, but all and all together, NO. they arent the same. i cant go on to say how i think they are different without using very broad stereotypes.... so yeah.... i think most nu metal sucks balls. next time i hear a new song by Trapt or Trustcompany, im gonna slit someones throat.
No. Visual-kei is a type of band image, not a music genre.
Yeah , I'm going to agree with Vessicator on that.
There are very few bands that sound nu-metal in vk. It's either generic metal-ish or some weird thrash , or just....yeah.
I don't know much about nu-metal, but I'd say it's still one more or less coherent musical genre. I find it hard to put bands like, say, Shazna, UnsraW and D'air into the same musical genre.
Audience: Again, I don't know much about the "typical nu-metal" audience, but regarding the japanese vk audience I'd say: late teens, early twens, mostly girls, but not exclusively, and certainly not your typical rebellious teenager. Nowadays the girls at vk lives look like ordinary girls on the street, like small Ayumi Hamasakis rather than some estranged goth that wants to shock their parents with a lip piercing.
In either case, nu-metal in general is far more popular than vk in japan, so I don't really think you can compare the two audiences.
PVs: Depends on the band. For most vk indies bands the idea of a PV is dress up nicely, find an empty warehouse, let the vocalist do all those kabuki-esque, theatrical exaggerations like rolling eyes, odd gestures, staring around emptily etc. and then add some cheesy effect in post-production. :D
If they have more budget things are of course more smooth, and maybe some random shock value is added for fun. Once they're major things get really shiney.
In nu-metal you'll probably find few bands that start producing PVs before they reached a certain level of popularity, or have the budget to do something that looks neat enough already. PVs in the west are usually produced for TV, while vk bands release them with their singles or as seperate releases, and only some of the major bands end up on television at all.
Yeah, I know that Visual Kei isn't really a music genre, that's why I said "Music community" I suppose. I'd rather not get into it.
There's a lot of musical styles in Visual Kei, while nu-metal is more established as a sound. However, some say that VK has an established sound in some senses. So I dunno. There are things that I find similar, but a lot that are dissimilar.
Whoever says that VK has an established sound is a dumbass.
In fact, most people say that VK is a music genre. They're dumbasses.
Some people say that J-Rock is a fashion. They're also dumbasses.
In this kind of argument it helps to be politically correct, otherwise you just make yourself look like an idiot.
Thread won!
Quote from: Alice the Sister on May 16, 2007, 04:20:26 AM
There's a lot of musical styles in Visual Kei, while nu-metal is more established as a sound. However, some say that VK has an established sound in some senses. So I dunno. There are things that I find similar, but a lot that are dissimilar.
I'd say there are musical genres within vk. That's where they're similar. I'm not re-inventing the wheel when I say that bands like UnsraW, Sadie and Sel'm more or less belong to the same musical genre. But they're still different from a band like Lareine or D'air. That's where they're dissimilar.
I really don't think that this much of a controversy though. *shrug* Why is it more "political correct" to say it's a musical genre? Why would anyone care? I certainly don't.
True.
The only thing necessary for stupidity to succeed is for smart people to do nothing~
Quote from: Vessicator on May 16, 2007, 02:54:17 AM
No. Visual-kei is a type of band image, not a music genre.
QFE.
Babylon's lyrics aren't really cheesy. The new Renter en Soi's on the other hand...
Quote from: Alice the Sister on May 16, 2007, 02:48:38 AM
I was listening to a song by Babylon the other day and the guitars and the vocals reminded me of how some of the workings were on some numetal songs.
just out of curiosity, may I know which song?
about babylon's lyrics, they usually tend to be more in the romantic side, pretty vk cliche. blame takuma on that. anyway sometimes he comes up with some interesting lyrics. but i don't seem them related to american nu metal.
anyway about visual kei being like nu metal, I don't think so... as everyone said, vk is not a music genre, in the same band you can have 10 songs all with different styles and genres. also in terms of scene or fanbase, mmm vk haves mostly teenager girls who look after the bishies, and a mature audience who maybe dont go to concerts too often but still listen to the bands they used to listen to in their youth (back in the day, visual kei wasn't limited to girls only).
i think in a way, you could compare vk to numetal because of the amount of teenagers listening to it... and more because to be part of some sort of scene rather than liking the actual music.
I don't know which song. Got a lot of songs on random, and last.fm only goes back 10 songs. Unless you know a way to find out which song you last listened to from a certain artist.
Quote from: Alice the Sister on May 16, 2007, 06:11:11 AM
I don't know which song. Got a lot of songs on random, and last.fm only goes back 10 songs. Unless you know a way to find out which song you last listened to from a certain artist.
Below your recent tracks, click on "Edit/see more...". My listening history goes back for 2 weeks there.
Quote from: Naja on May 16, 2007, 06:06:23 AM
Quote from: Alice the Sister on May 16, 2007, 02:48:38 AM
I was listening to a song by Babylon the other day and the guitars and the vocals reminded me of how some of the workings were on some numetal songs.
just out of curiosity, may I know which song?
about babylon's lyrics, they usually tend to be more in the romantic side, pretty vk cliche. blame takuma on that. anyway sometimes he comes up with some interesting lyrics. but i don't seem them related to american nu metal.
anyway about visual kei being like nu metal, I don't think so... as everyone said, vk is not a music genre, in the same band you can have 10 songs all with different styles and genres. also in terms of scene or fanbase, mmm vk haves mostly teenager girls who look after the bishies, and a mature audience who maybe dont go to concerts too often but still listen to the bands they used to listen to in their youth (back in the day, visual kei wasn't limited to girls only).
i think in a way, you could compare vk to numetal because of the amount of teenagers listening to it... and more because to be part of some sort of scene rather than liking the actual music.
I think you mean post-hardcore/anything with '-core' at the end: emocore, metalcore, grindcore, deathcore, corecore etc. I've never known scene kiddies to listen to nu-metal; Linkin Park is more of a guilty pleasure if anything.
mathcore?
XD
Anyways the song was
Babylon - Hana no miyako, ware, chirikeri
Don't ask...
oh yeah, the good ol' Hana no miyako :P i remember the first time i listened to it back in 2004... i was loving it to death during the intro then the crunchy guitars came in, Takuma rapping and I was like "WTF...".
I like it now, especially the chorus and bridge have some very delicate arrangements which I have never heard in nu metal songs (not that I have listened to many anyway...), but I know what you mean.
but personally i wouldnt call babylon nu-metal... anyway i wouldnt catogirze them in any genre, but if I had to, i'd put them under hard rock or something like that... most of their songs are either heavy metal influenced or punk influenced, or a mix of both.
simple answer: no. *basically for the same reason vessicator said*
I've always compared VK to glam/glitter rock (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glam_rock) of the 70's/80's. Glam rock was also confused as a genre when really it was a style. You had David Bowie, Kiss, Elton John, Alice Cooper, Queen, and a lot of different bands. It even resurfaced years later in a style called Neo-glam. Anywho what made glam rock what it was was the theatrics; just like VK. And just like VK you had adrogynous fashion and all kinds of things very similar to VK is now.
It's not easy to compare VK to anything non japanese though because the cultures are very different and especially in Japan; it seems japanese culture shows up strongly in -everything-. But from what I know about VK and Glam Rock, they're quite similar and so was the fanbase in some aspect; although I think Glam Rock attracted WAY more male fans then VK does. I've seen quite a few music videos from some glam rock artists that I would say they are somewhat similar to VK PVs.
Anywho, that's my opinion. I've never thought VK was like numetal. I've always compared it to glam rock and when I tell people about VK if they ask, is that its like glam rock. Because as much as people (especially guys I find) will act weirded out by VK fashion and how they look like 'women'; those same people usually like bands such as Kiss, Queen, David Bowie and or Alice Cooper.
^ except they look a LOT more like women LOL
comes with the asian features tho. bowie can pull off a pretty good looking lady.
Quote: "I can't be wapanese if I'm already asian :)"
I rofld.
^ that sounds like lovetricks pathetic sentence... pshhh
uanyone can be wapanese if they arent japanese. W stands for wannabe..DUHH
Quote from: asukayakuza1234 on May 22, 2007, 12:24:05 PM
^ that sounds like lovetricks pathetic sentence... pshhh
uanyone can be wapanese if they arent japanese. W stands for wannabe..DUHH
Are you like, 11 or something?
(http://wiki.theppn.org/images/d/d6/W_5th_single_Ai_no_Imi_wo_Oshiete.jpg)
W?
STANDS FOR DOUBLE YOU.
best group ever.
Visual, to me, was an artistic movement for freedom of expression.
Nu Metal is metal. I think, since, we were approaching a new millenia, it was solely a marketing gimmick.
So... V-kei wins by forfeit!