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Author Topic: Anti-leechers  (Read 16756 times)
Quorthon
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« on: May 03, 2007, 02:10:22 PM »

I think it's time to put an anti-leecher ratio limit, there just not enough people who seeds properly things after finished downloading. I don't think if it's applicable here but I think the best way it's to deny viewing new torrents to people who doesn't have at least a ratio of 0.3
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DO
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« Reply #1 on: May 03, 2007, 02:35:12 PM »

I'm going to change the software Tonberry uses to something that is somewhat similar to the older Tonberry. I don't think I'm ever going to add ratio rules to the site I have never followed what the other tracker sites did simple because ratio rules are kinda lame.
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Quorthon
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« Reply #2 on: May 03, 2007, 02:39:30 PM »

I don't think I'm ever going to add ratio rules to the site I have never followed what the other tracker sites did simple because ratio rules are kinda lame.

Why not? It improves file sharing and gives more freedom to assidous releasers (like me) in order to release more stuff sooner, just watch the mo'some tonebender discography, 42 people completed it but I'm the only seeders by 2 weeks 'till now, I think it's kinda impolite this way.
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Guidecca
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« Reply #3 on: May 03, 2007, 09:05:48 PM »

To tell the truth I have yet to see any significant improvement between private ratio trackers vs. public trackers. In fact I'd say public trackers usually have more seeds/leechers compared to a private tracker.

While the whole ratio thing seems like a nice idea at first it has its shortcomings, for example let's look at jpopsuki:
  • Their sharing rules are based on two parameters: total ratio and total upload, you have to fulfill both parameters in order to reduce your waiting time.
  • If you create a new account you must have a ratio higher than 0.6 and a shiny total upload of at least 2GB in order to have no waiting time.
  • The ratio issue is easily fixed, the upload issue is not. Since you have a waiting time you get less chance to seed the newest torrents, and we know those are the hot new ones and most people will want to get them; so this means people will spend even more time trying to reach their 2GB quota since they will have less people wanting to leech since they already got the stuff they wanted.
  • However, there’s another catch when it comes to ratio rules: DHT. As you might know modern bittorrent software uses DHT in order to operate without the need of a tracker, so in case the tracker goes down you can still get the files. But there’s a catch, even if the tracker is refusing your connection due the ratio settings you can still get the files and totally bypass the tracker, and since you aren’t registering anything with the tracker, any seeding you might do won’t be reflected in the tracker’s status.

And finally: public accounts. There are sites out there (like bugmenot) with the sole purpose of posting public accounts so you can bypass registration at certain sites. Jpopsuki has a public account, in fact, it was me who registered and posted it to bugmenot. So a lot of people are using that account besides me and they are using it to leech without having to wait; some of the people who use that account seed, some of them don’t, it doesn’t matter, the account has a 1.15 ratio with an upload of 2.68 TB and I’m sure a lot of people have benefited from it, seeding or not.

It's probably easy/better to ask the original uploader for a re-seed rather than try to get people to seed. Ratios don't make people seed, they just make it harder for people to get the files they want. If they are not going to seed, they are not going to seed, there's always a way to bypass the ratio filters.
« Last Edit: May 03, 2007, 09:08:41 PM by Guidecca » Logged
klavierbarrette
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« Reply #4 on: May 03, 2007, 10:22:19 PM »

i'd really like there to be some kind of ratio system, but then again my ratio would probably suck since my upload is so poor, but i think it helps.

one thing i would like is for the forum to tell us how many seeders and leechers their are for a torrent so we don't waste our time and go WTF when it suddenly stops at 90%
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Do As Eternity 6
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« Reply #5 on: May 03, 2007, 11:32:22 PM »

i didnt realize jpopsuki depended on upload size too i thought it was just ratio...because when i first signed up and got my ratio up i don't think i had 2GB u/l but then again it was a very very long time ago and i really don't have to worry about the ratio issue since mine is almost 3 i think it doesn't really cross my mind... well if it isn't the whole private tracker / ratio thing than what is it that keeps jpopsuki torrents seeded so nicely =_= *let's harness their seeding greatness*


*takes notes about bugmenot*


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誰もいない街
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Guidecca
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« Reply #6 on: May 04, 2007, 12:43:20 AM »

Quote
well if it isn't the whole private tracker / ratio thing than what is it that keeps jpopsuki torrents seeded so nicely =_= *let's harness their seeding greatness*
Based on my own non-scientific measuring I can tell you that the fact that Jpopsuki is at least ~20 times bigger than Tonberry helps.
  • Tonberry Total Members: 6999
  • Jpopsuki Total Members: 144915

(Based on forum accounts for both sites, so give or take some users)

Just compare the amount of torrents that get posted over there in the course of a day against the number of torrents that get posted here, and that's not even taking into account their forum posts:
  • Tonberry Total Posts: 10744
  • Jpopsuki Total Posts: 283174

That's quite a big difference in size, isn't it?

And just for fun let's compare us with a popular all purpose general public tracker such as Mininova:
  • Total seeds: 3,642,267
  • Total leechers: 4,244,771

And they have no such thing as ratio rules.

Size does matter.
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Do As Eternity 6
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« Reply #7 on: May 04, 2007, 03:19:28 AM »

ah you speak trueness ...i guess i just never looked into it enough *'m enlightened*
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誰もいない街
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DO
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« Reply #8 on: May 08, 2007, 05:47:39 AM »

I don't think I'm ever going to add ratio rules to the site I have never followed what the other tracker sites did simple because ratio rules are kinda lame.

Why not? It improves file sharing and gives more freedom to assidous releasers (like me) in order to release more stuff sooner, just watch the mo'some tonebender discography, 42 people completed it but I'm the only seeders by 2 weeks 'till now, I think it's kinda impolite this way.

Total Members: 7056 and we don't get donations. Don't you think that is kind of impolite? Bandwidth doesn't grow on trees Wink and running a site on a dedicated server is by no means cheap. But in all honesty I don't really care if anyone donates or not I just want have a site were people can trade music freely and without restrictions.
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Alice the Sister
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« Reply #9 on: May 08, 2007, 03:56:55 PM »

Ratio rules suck. Even though I seed like a madman I don't think you should be forced to do it. I don't post torrents here because I know there won't be any seeders. I know other people have mentioned this too. So I guess if you want more content, maybe you should seed more.
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Quorthon
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« Reply #10 on: May 08, 2007, 09:59:08 PM »

I don't post torrents here because I know there won't be any seeders. I know other people have mentioned this too. So I guess if you want more content, maybe you should seed more.

Damn, ratio rules are made for that!!  Angry
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Alice the Sister
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« Reply #11 on: May 08, 2007, 10:24:39 PM »

I know plenty of communities that don't force ratio rules, but still have reasonable amounts of seeders. I guess it all depends on the community, too.

Tonberry is kind of stuck in a rut now. If they don't enforce ratio rules, they might risk less content. If they enforce ratio rules, people might go somewhere where there's no ratio rules or just give up on the torrents altogether.

If we had enough releasers, there'd be a chance we could get enough peers on those torrents in order to warrant peers sticking around. I post a lot of torrents on other sites, and I find that torrents that attract the most users usually have the most seeders. Ratio rules or not. If you want people to download your stuff and stick around you have to give them something good. Something that they'll want to keep seed for a long time.
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« Reply #12 on: May 08, 2007, 10:31:24 PM »

to be honest, i hate leechers! but i hate uplaod ratio limits MORE! they suck shit, @ jpopsuki i was gonna post a dvd but couldnt cos of my ratio.... so. i think there are more seeds here than anywhere else! but i will say the ratio limit should be above 0.2!
thts so easy to avoid and means ppl tht upload NOTHING will have to Smiley, so i think thats the best option imo. and if sum1 is under 0.2, it wont be hard to raise their ratio to that since its so low Smiley
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ramrod - Man of ur wetdreams
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« Reply #13 on: May 09, 2007, 12:14:30 AM »

ya... a low ratio limit is a good option because ppl don't really need to spend alot of time just seeding, as they can also download in this time without changing much of the ratio, or making it really lower
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ushi
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« Reply #14 on: May 11, 2007, 12:31:37 PM »

well i upload atleast 2.0 of every torrent i dl from here...and its sad to see that many just hit n´ run with the torrents...so yeah..please make a ratio system...

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